3bet OOP against TAG?

[ErinJeff]

V has been aggro but I have no previous history with him. Over 23 I have him at 17/8/4 with AFq 80%. This seems a commitment type bet, and I'm not sure how to proceed.

PokerStars Game #19796568896: Hold'em No Limit ($0.25/$0.50) - 2008/08/21 - 20:05:16 (ET)
Table 'Havnia III' 9-max Seat #9 is the button
Seat 1: TaiShan07 ($31.25 in chips)
Seat 2: ErinJeff ($50.75 in chips)
Seat 3: cmk9006 ($30.95 in chips)
Seat 4: gbandman21 ($46.75 in chips)
Seat 5: Oldgott ($8.50 in chips)
Seat 6: HeistGnWrong ($30.45 in chips)
Seat 7: Covad411 ($46.20 in chips)
Seat 8: Devil88888 ($10 in chips)
Seat 9: rockman255 ($54 in chips)
TaiShan07: posts small blind $0.25
ErinJeff: posts big blind $0.50
Devil88888: posts big blind $0.50
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to ErinJeff [Qd Ah]
cmk9006: folds
gbandman21: folds
Oldgott: folds
HeistGnWrong: folds
Covad411: raises $1.50 to $2
Devil88888: folds
rockman255: folds
TaiShan07: folds
ErinJeff: raises $4 to $6
Covad411: calls $4
*** FLOP *** [Kc As 9c]
ErinJeff: bets $8
Covad411: raises $9 to $17
ErinJeff: ??

[Yozman]

your crushed, give up

[miaowmiaowchowface]

fairly easy fold unless he's capable of bluffing

[xDiamond_CutteRx]

Against any but the most intelligent, creative players, this should be a fold. At a higher level, it's probably raise/fold, but there is no need to get tricky at this level.

[kingetje]

hmm. if i 3bet AQ, get called, flop an ace and i bet, im not folding anymore.

but this is full ring and stuff.. so i guess fold?

but in the topic title you say TAG and in the post you call him aggro.. not really the same things

[ErinJeff]

hmm. if i 3bet AQ, get called, flop an ace and i bet, im not folding anymore.

but this is full ring and stuff.. so i guess fold?

but in the topic title you say TAG and in the post you call him aggro.. not really the same things

By TAG I mean, tight-aggressive, not aggro-donk. How are they different?

[kingetje]

how are they different?


if you say "villain is tight aggressive"... then you say "villain has been aggro".. those are not the same things and portray two different villains


if you ask me


"aggro" is like, out of line/too agressive/bluffy etc etc. not the same thing as a standard taggy villain

[ErinJeff]

Got it. I meant them more synonymously. Point taken.

[MrDarling]

first 23 hands means nothing. He played 4 hands and raise 2 of them.
Second, if you view him as a TAG, why do you 3B his MP raise with AQo OOP. Is it for value? Is he really calling with worse?
Third, if you are going to 3B, bet more. something like $7 will do here.
And last, what are you hoping to achieve by betting this flop. Again, do you expect him to call with worse?

[ErinJeff]

AQo is a pretty good hand to 3bet/fold out a TAG pf IMO. I'm ahead of his range here. Granted sample size is a problem. Obviously I'm happy to take this pre. I can't see 3betting this pf, and checking an A hi flop, even OOP.

Assuming you played this (3bet pf) do you check this flop? Then what?

Text results appended to pokerstove.txt

3,225,980,736 games 0.005 secs 645,196,147,200 games/sec

Board:
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 52.426% 48.84% 03.59% 1575439236 115828662.00 { AQo }
Hand 1: 47.574% 43.98% 03.59% 1418884176 115828662.00 { 22+, ATs+, KJs+, QJs, ATo+, KJo+, QJo }

[gumbie]

lol @ folding in a 3 bet pot when you flop a pair of aces.

[Jernej Zorec]

lol @ folding in a 3 bet pot when you flop a pair of aces.

QFT

go broke there imo

[golddog]

I'd like to hear more from the 'easy fold' crowd.

Villian doesn't have AK, KK, or AA, I don't think, since there's no pre-flop re-raise.

So, we have a specific enough read that villian has A9 or 99? What is the reasoning behind us not being way ahead of a lot of villian's range?

My caveat is that I very rarely play NL cash, so this is a good learning experience.

[miaowmiaowchowface]

I'd like to hear more from the 'easy fold' crowd.

Villian doesn't have AK, KK, or AA, I don't think, since there's no pre-flop re-raise.

So, we have a specific enough read that villian has A9 or 99? What is the reasoning behind us not being way ahead of a lot of villian's range?

My caveat is that I very rarely play NL cash, so this is a good learning experience.

not always are these hands 4betted and you cant assume that -a very good read

[supafrey]

So is the fold only right if you think OP is tricky enough to call in pos with AA/AK?