All-in odd occurence - what do y'all think

[dkapke]

I had something occur tonight in our weekly poker game that not only have I never seen before, but I'm pretty sure no one has ever seen. Therefore, I'm not sure how it should have been handled. Here's the setup:

My hole cards are A-D and K-C. The flop comes up Q-D, J-S and 10-H. I've got a A-10 straight and it's a rainbow so there's little chance of a flush. Immediately, someone else goes all in. My thought was heck...worse case scenario we're tying, so I call. I show my cards, and his reaction is to declare "crap...my bluff got called" and throw his cards, face down, onto the table in the middle by the chips and the flop cards. In other words, he mucked on an all-in. The dealer then asks if he wants to show his cards and starts trying to convince him to just play it out. He continues to say "I'm dead...I only have a Q", but eventually, the dealer convinces him to turn them over and play it out. He turns up a Q and 5. Against all possible odds, he proceeds to get a Q and a J, creating a full-house. An viola, I'm out.

I cannot find anywhere that it says how to handle a muck on an all-in. I raised a stink about it, but technically it was an all-in, so regardless it should have been played through. I think I was shell-shocked more than anything, but it still doesn't seem right that it took the dealer to convince him to continue. The head man decided that as long as the cards didn't touch the folded cards/pile, and it didn't touch the chips, then it's still live. I guess the dealer should have just grabbed the cards, flipped them over, and played them without saying anything. Then again, the guy definitely shouldn't have "mucked" his cards like that.

Anyone have any idea the rules on this, and how would y'all have handled a situation like that? My thought was the cards were thrown face down - he decalred them dead, and the hand should have been over. I'm not sure about whether they touched other dead cards because that would DEFINITELY have been an issue. I'm 99% positive they did, but no one else was paying any attention, including the dealer (who just picked them up and moved them).

Thanks!

[MrDarling]

Haven't read the entire thread, but technically if cards are mucked they are dead.

Of course, house rules might differ, but if there are no rules he should no be able to retrieve his cards.

[Jauron]

If they didn't touch the discards or the pot or anything else this game uses as a "mucked" point then technically the hand is not mucked. Since he is all-in he can't verbally fold, it contradicts his last action.

The dealer was out of line to sit there and have a conversation about it, he should have either considered them mucked and scooped them up or flipped them over and finished the hand.

Dealers fault for making it painful but there really isn't anything out of line rule wise.