Hmmm, low pocket pairs.

[Poker_Vendetta]

All right, before I ask, IMO, a good question I'll explain the scenario which has inspired me to do so.

Me: KK

I am in the big blind and the chip leader raises to 550 UTG. I ponder and reraise all-in. Now, this could certainly be a little too much, but I really wanted that pot...anywho. With this raise I could suck in an inferior Ax or what not, in which case I had to dodge 4 cards. Now TOO bad. Or if he had anything like QJ, or KJ I certainly thought he would fold. However, he calls with 44...yes 44! I do not know how he can really call with this. Even in the circumstances that I have overcards it is a race! There is nothing you can do! But in this situation I have an overpair, and he hits a set. An ace came too so I thought I was going to lose anyway but I was surprised by this call. I suppose I could have JUST reraised about 2000 or so, and I was about to do so but I just went all-in and he made a bad call...Oh well!

Now this inspires my next question. If you hold a low-pocket pair, is it actually GOOD enough to call a big raise? In a cash game let's say you have an equal chip stack and a fairly tight-aggressive player goes all-in...it is to you to call, you both have broke even. You look down at 22, no how about 55? Are either of these legit to call? Even if you saw he had two over cards, 67s would you still considering calling? NEW scenario, let's say you have A 2-1 chip lead. The exact same situation, would you still call? It just surprises me when people act like pocket pairs are the best things to ever hit poker.

Anyway, I would appreciate your thoughts and speculations.

Thanks,
Poker_Vendetta

[karasz]

also depends on position... if the guy is on the button with 5s, i could see him making the call... i dont agree with it, but i am pretty conservative cuz im still relatively new to the game...

also there is always that loose guy that calls ya with anything...

see now theres the question where does the line between loose and just bad fall?


cuz i still personally think that moneymakers 54o play to see a flop was a bad call... of course flopping 2 pair to win the championship event kinda shuts the critics up...

[Poker_Vendetta]

Well, if you are loose again MANY opponents, loose-passive that is to say. You are certainly a bad player, and will lose your money no doubt. When you are loose in a short-handed game you might be able to get away with pure bluffs and flop two-pair with a usually inferior hand. Moneymaker was tight-aggressive when he had a regular stack, and occasionally loose like the David Grey hand. They thought he was going to be insanely aggressive after the flop, since he was a short stack. So he called with a 54o and he happened to get lucky. Grey was overly aggressive and pushed it in with a flush draw and Moneymaker won the pot with two-pair. Make no mistake about it, Chris Moneymaker is a great player, great and lucky...but luck is essential in a game with what? 800 buy-ins? Anyway...

[Dave B]

I might call w/ 44 against a big raise if it is down to heads up if I call and I have already committed a decent amt of chips. Many people will go over the top w/ A and anything suited, AK, AQ, KQ, KJ or the like. Any pocket pair heads up is a decent play.

However-it all depends on how many chips I have an how many the other guy has. Also, if it is a single or multitable tourney.

[Tralfaz]

Hey:

Its funny you should raise this situation because the same thing happened to me last night. I had AK suited on the button with 4 people left in an 18 person sit and go. Had about TC 4000 and blinds were 75/150. I raised it up to about 500. The big bling had about TC 6000 and went over the top all-in and I called.

He had 44. . . and the flop came 4 7 4. I couldn't belive it. But, I can't disagree with what he did. He wanted to drive me off of the pot preflop. Ah well, at least I finished in the $$.

As a side note, personally, I will lay down small pairs in the face of a large raise, unless I already have 50% of my chips committed or I strongly suspect that I am being robbed.

Tralfaz

Of course, now that I've posted that information here I'll start going all-in with any pair from now on.

[Dave B]

Here is my take on any hand in NL. There is 2 benefits of a big raise or an all in bet: 1) limit the field to one or 2 callers tops (or win out right) 2) increase the pot

I will play AA KK QQ JJ less aggressively than I will play 44 55 66 77. The reason, I am not as worried about being outdrawn. If I have a low pair, I will either just limp in and hope to flop a set or bet BIG and hope for one other caller.

If I have AA KK QQ JJ I prefer to bet big, but not so big that a few wont call. If everyone has 800 TC, then $100 or so. Hopefully I can get 2-3 callers and go all in w/ an overpair after the flop or someone will come over the top preflop and i can come all in.

[gliam]

I think small pocket pairs(22-88) are the easiest hands to play in NL. Basically you are looking to flop a set. The only exception is if you are very short-stacked in a tournament.

The odds of flopping a set is about 1:8, so in order to get implied odds to call, you opponents stack must be at least 8x the raise (preferably much more). All-in is a no-no, at best you are a small favorite to two overcards, at worst you are a big dog. If you don't flop a set, be done with the hand.

As far as your all-in with KK, it was a good move, the only reason you wouldn't want to do it is if you think you won't be called. But you mentioned that you wanted the pot as it was, so your all-in was a good move. The guy with the 44 made a terrible mistake, but got lucky.