how to play against players who bet huge bets?

[slawas2001]

Hi boys, I hope it is a good question for you. I play holdem with my friends, and I have one big problem, I start loosing any time they play huge bets. I know this is an extremely aggressive form of holdem. It takes place not at the beginning of the game, but at the end of the tournament when e.g there are 3 of us left, and one of them is trying to eliminate me with big stakes. This is difficult for me as I don't wan't to be eliminated. Is there A BOOK to read, or strategy I shuld use against them? please help me

Best regards,
Slawomir

[jeffonline]

A simple question, that goes to the heart of tournament poker, the answer is not so simple, we all do battle with this one every tournament. The books Harrington on Hold ‘em Vol 1,2 & 3.
In the meantime be aware that they are pushing you around with a wide range of hands, you may consider being more aggressive with a wider range of hands yourself especially when first to act.

[jimmer]

Harrington on Hold ‘em Vol 2 would answer this question better than 1 or 3, but as Jeff said, all three books are a good read and would help you address the question.

[slawas2001]

Great Thanks!! Can you also tell me what are the differences between vol 1,2 and 3, just in brief. I know the books are translated into Polish only vol.1 and probably my friends could have already read it. I don't want fall too much into books, as POKER is only free time entertainment. I will probably read vol 1 and 2. Could you tell me what is so important in vol3 that is not included in vol 1,2?

Best regards,
Slawomir

[jimmer]

Vol 1 deals with the early stages of a tourney, when the blinds are small - compared to the stack sizes.

Vol 2 deals with later in a tourney, when the blinds are alot bigger - compared to the stacks sizes.

Vol 3 is a workbook with lots of questions.

The thing with all three books is; Dan Harrington uses 'real' examples, so sometimes he knows a lot of info about the players sat around him, other times he simply describes them as 'an internet qualifier clearly playing in his first major tourney'.

He also explains the reasoning for his desicions which i find far more helpful than some books where the author simply writes 'Fold' etc

A deffinate buy imo

[slawas2001]

It's is strange but at the beginning of the tournament I play quite well.

80-90% games I stay until the last 3 players and I think it is because I play very tight. I've just started reading super system 1, and the more possibilities I can predict prior to the more tight I play, and I usually play the right hands.

But, when it comes to the final games, and the big blinds are 1/10 - 1/5 of my stack I start loosing it all. I think it is quite dependent of luck, and it is almost gambling for me. Maybe if I read vol.2 and vol. 3 Harrington book it will be easier for me to get it. I have the advantage of reading in English, and any of my friends doesn't. :):)

If you have any ideas where I can find something about holdem positions at the table I would be thankful as well.

Regards, and thanks a lot!

slawomir

[lwestatbus]

Welcome to the forum. This was a very good question.

I haven't gotten to Harrington Vol. 2 yet but I've had some experiences with 36-player sit and go tournaments that applies to your question. I also play pretty tightly in the early stages of tournaments and I regularly make it deep in the tournaments but with an average size chip stack. You have to recognize a problem that first appears with 19-20 players and really appears when you get down to 10-14 players. The tables become short-handed and the blinds start coming around much faster than they did in the earlier stages of the tournament and they are larger. You can go from 2 times the chip average to life support in just a short while without ever playing a hand.

What you have to do is open up the range of hands you play a lot. It sounds as if this is what your friends are doing. And if you look at the relative chip stack sizes and consider the pot sizes it will often make sense for a shorter stacked blind player to call with anything and a single limper with larger blinds can also tilt the balance for a larger stacked player to call with better cards. In this case the all in or very large bet size may make a lot of sense. You would be trying to isolate yourself against the big blind and possibly push them off of their blind if their cards are bad enough.

You basically have to gamble.

[slawas2001]

I've read super system and tried to play it, and I felt I could almost kill most of the players with it (I regret I haven't done it :]),but I took most of chips from most of the players at the table(well maybe that was coincidence, not sure) And then when the final came the player against me was playing huge bets indepedently of the cards he had, I couldnt guess what cards he played at all. I couldn't take the lead in game. I just wasnt able to play, I got cold feet in most cases and pulled out at turn, or at river. Such big bets he played. He took most of my chips. I didn't check any of his hands.I've lost.

The question is, can the Harrington vol. 2 help me in this problem? Do you suggest reading only this one, or better start with vol.1? Can I understand Harrington's philosphy if I start reading from vol 2?

Best regards,
and thanks to jeffonline, jimmer, and to iwestatbus for all the suggestions...

Slawomir

[jimmer]

The question is, can the Harrington vol. 2 help me in this problem? Do you suggest reading only this one, or better start with vol.1? Can I understand Harrington's philosphy if I start reading from vol 2?

Yes, you can pick up vol 2 straight away and it will make sense.

This is why he has sold so many. He explains everything really well, so it doesn't matter too much if you haven't read vol 1.

I would say I've learnt more about poker from reading any one of these three books than any other poker book i've ever read.

[UrAteUp]

I've read super system and tried to play it, and I felt I could almost kill most of the players with it (I regret I haven't done it :]),but I took most of chips from most of the players at the table(well maybe that was coincidence, not sure) And then when the final came the player against me was playing huge bets indepedently of the cards he had, I couldnt guess what cards he played at all. I couldn't take the lead in game. I just wasnt able to play, I got cold feet in most cases and pulled out at turn, or at river. Such big bets he played. He took most of my chips. I didn't check any of his hands.I've lost.

Slawomir I really love it when I am playing poker and I get put into this situation. I generally try to hold out till I get a big hand and then just push back. You have to find a time when you say enough is enough and push back. I generally do it with hands like AK, KK, QQ. Most times you will find that by taking and reversing the situation back onto the other player that he was just trying to push you around with sub-standard hands.

[clarky]

I experienced that when my friend and i had a home games and as he gave me a few tips to beat my opponent with a huge bet is to put more money in when you bet or raise with a premium hand to isolate him. If isolating him fails then you must play more conservatively when you have a marginal hand in a multi-way pot.