overpair vs min raise 33$ 10k

[mortaleclipse]

playing 33$ 10k last night and get JJ in the hijack with the chip leader whos been pretty active. Seen him spew some chips with crazy bluffs but also seen him bet the goods to. Basically everyone else has had goods hands against him but they been 2nd best for the hour we hvae been playing. He has seen a ton of flops. Sry for no hand history. Posted this on 2+2 but got about the most retarded answers.
blinds 50/100

villain has 12k and limps UTG+1
Hero has 5.1k and raises to 325 with JJ
everyone folds to him and he calls.

flop 497 rainbow. I bet 550 he min raises to 1100 and I call. Turn comes a 8 and he leads with 1400. Now on me?

[odlozilik]

I shove the flop here, almost no card coming is good. If I am behind, that's life.

[Ensano]

shove

[mortaleclipse]

I shove the flop here, almost no card coming is good. If I am behind, that's life.

Please explain what we are beating besides a spazzed out 9

[odlozilik]

I shove the flop here, almost no card coming is good. If I am behind, that's life.

Please explain what we are beating besides a spazzed out 9

You said he sees tons of flops and makes many bluffs, so this kind of flop suits him very well, he can have any pair, any draw, any lower pockets. Well, true, the flop minraise may indicate the strength, but he might just test where he stands too (you might have a read, what he likes to minraise with).
So, if you are convinced he beats you, fold the flop or turn, but as you described villain's play, I would prefer to shove.

[kompis]

if im really trying my best id prolly just fold the turn and wait fora better spot. but most of the time i just shove the flop. fck him and his minraise

[MJJ]

Other option is to reraise the flop if you are worried about his hand- this might be a good play if you have decided you will credit him for a hand if he comes back over the top. if you are still thinking he might be bluffing, you need to decide if you are going to test him or wait for a different spot.
Based on your description (wild bluffs and betting the goods) I lean towards reraising the flop w/ the idea to take down the pot there or folding if he shoves- at least he has to make a decision on the hand that way.


EDIT- After thinking a little (unusual) I think it's a push- any raise commits you anyway. Given his 'wild bluffs' I take my chances w/ JJ. if he was playing ABC poker, I probably fold instead.

[MrDarling]

raise more PF. shove flop. fold turn unless you've seen him take this line with no pair no draw. The 8 is a bad card as it complete a lot of 2 pairs and straight draws.

[mortaleclipse]

The only problem with raising the flop is if he shoves I would be commited and 99% im dead. Think that line wouldnt work "to see were I was at" type of bet. If I was 10k + stack I would have. Just shoving cause I got a overpair is pretty stupid type of thinking, we are not putting villain on any type of range and just spewing imo.

[odlozilik]

Just shoving cause I got a overpair is pretty stupid type of thinking, we are not putting villain on any type of range and just spewing imo.

Well, this is a pretty confident statement considering 5 people are, moreless, suggesting you to shove the flop. As posted, you have probably lost the hand, but we shouldn't be result oriented.
And, I did put villain on range: any pair, any draw, any lower pockets. Plus, of course, some hands that beat you (set, 2 pair, straight on the turn), but you beat most of the villain's range.

[miaowmiaowchowface]

CIB-call flop or call and shove over his bet on almost any turn. the problem with calling is u can get a retarded card like this one. I'd still shove though.

[mortaleclipse]

Just shoving cause I got a overpair is pretty stupid type of thinking, we are not putting villain on any type of range and just spewing imo.

Well, this is a pretty confident statement considering 5 people are, moreless, suggesting you to shove the flop. As posted, you have probably lost the hand, but we shouldn't be result oriented.
And, I did put villain on range: any pair, any draw, any lower pockets. Plus, of course, some hands that beat you (set, 2 pair, straight on the turn), but you beat most of the villain's range.

Odzola im not saying you guys are wrong there is just no reason behind it. Not saying you guys are wrong at all, and honestly I have no idea what he had. I folded, just was curious on why we should shove other then we have a overpair.

[MJJ]

The key for me is you talking about him spewing chips with crazy bluffs- if you believe he can/is doing this, you have to act on it.
I guess I can see folding to the reraise on the flop (although I don't like it) and prefer pushing it. Calling the flop, then folding the turn isn't ideal (even though the turn was the worst card possible)

[odlozilik]

just was curious on why we should shove other then we have a overpair.

Again, we should shove because we beat the very most of villain's range, as we have the read on him, and we don't like to allow him to hit the straight, 2 pair or overcard for cheap.

[ErinJeff]

Haven't read the other responses...

Against this player my overpair is in push or fold territory on the flop minraise. I wouldn't just flat call it unless really deep.