Hacking and Cheating at Online Gambling?

[Avatar]

Is it possible that someone can develop a hack for some of these poker rooms software, and make it so they can see the other player's hands?

I used to be a big gamer in online games and there were always hacks out that changed the game. Ie - Playing Starcraft, I could only see my part of the map, but my opponent, who had a hack to the software could view the entire map - his and my screen.

How safe are the software of sites like partpoker, pokerroom, UB, etc., from hackers?

Are programs already out, and we don't know about it?

Thoughts?

[sergestorms]

i highly doubt there are cheating programs out there, but with some of the calls and bets ive seen people make i don't believe it is impossible heh

[cayouche]

Taken from http://teamfu.freeshell.org/online_poker_cheating.html:

"Coming from a computer background, I have a good knowledge of how most software applications are written and how server software operates. My assumption would be that Party Poker only sends to your computer data about the board and your hand. Only at showdown does it actually send data about other players to your computer. Sending the data for each player would be a completely insane approach in terms of security- and any good programmer would know not to write a server in this fashion. You can say your computer is on a "need to know basis" when it comes to poker data. Because of this, there is no feasible way to cheat because you are only limited to the amount of data you have on your computer. There is also close to a zero perecent chance of being able to send data to online poker servers that would have you magically win a hand or get cards of your choosing. It would take deliberate coding on the part of the online sites to have this happen- and again, it would not be in their best interests (or so we hope)."

[Absolution]

Ya that sums it up. The only way someone could cheat that way is if they hacked the servers. It's also not some little video game. It's very structured and since it actually means something (money), they are much more serious about security. Don't try and compare them and don't play if you're underage.

[Avatar]

Ya that sums it up. The only way someone could cheat that way is if they hacked the servers. It's also not some little video game. It's very structured and since it actually means something (money), they are much more serious about security. Don't try and compare them and don't play if you're underage.

Thanks for the great reply cayouche.

In reply to Absolution's post, you were probably just trying to be humerous, so thats ok, but I think my concern was a worthy concern by anyone who puts their money into online gaming.
In response to your "some little video game", I was a professional gamer in 1999, and made a little over $30,000 U.S. gaming online that year. And was only in high school at the time. Not bad for some little video game. :D

And I am 21 years old now. So yes, I am of age.

[JohnnyCache]

You could compromise the computer of another player, if you played them regularly . . .

I think the easiest way of cheating online would be collusion.. . .

[cayouche]

(...)but I think my concern was a worthy concern by anyone who puts their money into online gaming.(...)

Not only online gambling, but anything that has to do with money and/or credit cards on the Net. Many are afraid of PayPal, eBay, and other sites that deal with money/credit cards.

On that site (link above), there's a link on the left about general online cheating, very interesting...

[thecadman]

Not sure why they were cheating in play money, but there really isn't any other explanation unless they were a ringer bot being used... but a ringer bot in play money??? come on!

There was a player who always seemed to know what everyone had and what was about to come and nobody could ever win a hand against them. They would go all in when they paired a 2 on the board and catch their second pair on the turn or river against AA or KK paired. Flush draws and straights were non stop and this guy always had the nut end. He would fold here and there, but also would go all in with complete trash and pair both cards, get his flush or straight. It was absolute insanity and I stuck around and watched for quite some time just folding most every hand and playing only the premium hands just to see him snag em with 36o. People would come and go from the table in a matter of 10 hands because this guy would clean them out. He ended up with over 2 million before I couldn't stand watching anymore and left the table.

Watched a similiar miracle situation happen again, but I stuck around a lot less sicne I had already witnessed the whole scene once before.

I have no other explanation other then cheating and "It was just their day" isn't going to work!

[Avatar]

This suspected cheater had 2 million what? Real Dollars? Did I mis-read that?

[thecadman]

Real Dollars? Did I mis-read that?

Yep you did, but I probably didn't make it clear enough sorry. My first sentence said it was play money.

[iloveholdem]

Yes it is possible, would take a lot then a game but possible..

[PokerGoblin]

Yes it is possible, I don't know how feasible it is though. Remember it is a program, that is, nothing more than a box in a warehouse somewhere in costa rica or whereever.

Consider a few unknowns first. When you are dealt your cards, is the 52 card deck already predetermined at that point or is each card to each player a randomly generated event from a random number generator? If the deck is predetermined, it would theoritically be possible for a hacker program to be running concurrently w/ the poker program that could potentially identify the order the cards lie in the deck, once it knew the first 2 hole cards after they are identified. It is the same thing as the dude in Vegas who won a Keno jackpot buy relaying the first couple numbers revealed to his partner in his hotelroom, who was at a computer w/ a random number generator. He was busted when after he won, they learned he worked for the LV Gaming Control Board and they raided his room. He got like 3 years for that.

If each card is a newly generated event, it would be virtually inpossible to know what was coming of what someone had.

Another way to potentially hack a system is to have a program running alongside the pokersite that automatically logged in as your opponents. However they usually have safeguards that don't allow one account to be logged on from more than one ip address. Furthermore it would be complicated by the fact that you don't want to actually interact with your opponents hands (betting folding raising etc) for them, you just want their cards to be identified. Perhaps the poker program has an override that would allow a moderator or overseer to view activity at a given table... if a program could disguise itself as the moderator you could see everything?

I have no real computer programming skills along these lines, but if someone does could you let me know how reasonable these scenarios are? I've often wondered how they are written and if it is possible to hack them, and more importantly the likelyhood that my opponent has this capability.

Thats my take on the whole situation.

PG

[thecadman]

I have no real computer programming skills along these lines, but if someone does could you let me know how reasonable these scenarios are? I've often wondered how they are written and if it is possible to hack them, and more importantly the likelyhood that my opponent has this capability.

Anything that is programmed can be hacked eventually. It's only a matter of time. That's why you do see cardrooms making constant upgrades to their software. However, hackers always seem to be ahead of the game. Keep in mind also that hackers who were convicted of severe hacking crimes are now being hired left and right by major companies to help protect them against other hackers. What a crazy world.

[grandmaster_2b]

poker expert here

i have an interesting answer that ive rather discuss via email

grandmaster_2b@yahoo.com

[Fat Tony]

poker expert here

i have an interesting answer that ive rather discuss via email

grandmaster_2b@yahoo.com

i'd rather you discussed it in the forum, or if you prefer, by pm thru this forum. you have too many posts begging people to e-mail you to be taken seriously by anyone here. if you want to pm me the details of what is so secret you can't discuss it in the forum, i will be more than happy to let people know if it's worth persuing or not.