1 piece of beginner advice that everyone should stick to

[reidy125]

More advanced players will not have to read this, you will already know this, so don't bother, cos I will just get messages saying this is the most obvious rule ever. That's why I posted it in the beginner section.
I think this may be one of the best pieces of advice to a beginner, I haven't been playing long but I picked it up pretty quick, it's one of the most important principles in poker, .... trust me!

Well here it is:

Beginners call way too much, why? Because they think they have a chance of winning the pot with their pocket 88's, or other hole cards that dont hit the flop, which, of course they do, but only in some cases.
It is a calling hand, but when the flop comes up like this:

AKQ

a beginner will call for that 3rd 8, on the turn or river, where the calling gets more expensive.

This is just one example.It's not just these situations but pocket cards like A6 should NOT be called, they may look good, especially when suited, spaded looks real nice for some resaon, but really whay you have to do is FOLD!
In micro limit games, the players/flop percentage will usually be between 70-80%, this is insane, this is the games you want to be playing against, if it's 80%+(which, sometimes it is) you wanna get on that table, cos people really will play 23o, because they're connected, and 3s9s, cos they're suited, i'd love to know what the 20% is that they don't play!

I know sometimes we all let our heart rule our head, and will sometimes call, (it's only 25c, i can afford it) but 25c, 10, 20, or 100 times is $2.50, $5 or even $25 that has gone nowhere.
I once read that betting on your cards is like an investment, and truly it is, it is purely an investment, so what the hell is the point investing in it if you are odds on to lose?????

Anyway, dont know why i felt compelled to write this thread, maybe I'm trying to teach myself something that I can't seem to stick to. This may help me practice what I preach, cos I've just lost $20, by going on tilt and trying to get back to evens, and, admittedly, playing A6, but that's cos I was on tilt, and I shouldn't have been.
The golden rule is to fold anything that is not worth betting on, you will learn what that is over time, maybe this thread will ensure it cost you less to work it out for yourself.
Why do players call so much when they know it'll cost them?? Because they get BORED! Don't let this happen to you, listen to music, watch TV if you have to, even read a book on poker, or this website, even read this thread, just don't fall into the trap of gettin gbored, because you will call way too much, just for something to do.
This type of tactic applies to a limit 10 player ring game, where there will be a lot of callers pre and post flop.
If I had a bit more time to write this I would have wrote more, so if there are any spelling/grammar mistakes its cos i havent reread it. I have to go now, thanks for reading!

[reidy125]

hey was my advice THAT bad? at least someone could comment!

[ballbp]

I agreed with you about many people playing WAY too many hands. I didn't think I needed to tell you. No really, some of the people I play with will call almost any pre-flop bet just to see what the flop brings. They don't understand why a couple of hours into the game their stack has dwindled but they can't recall any hand that took a substantial amount of their chips. I thought I'd explain it to them but decided that was something I had to learn on my own and so should they.

[SmilinMark21]

I am new to tournaments but have played with friends for many years, i foudn your advice very true ( i have been playing pot limit £5 buy in tournaments (£5 - $3)), but i think especially in low limit, a lot of people are taking shots in the dark, they are there for the enjoyment and less so for the winning, they like the social aspect

that isnt me, i want to learn, improve and build my game but when playing the pot limit game above i do play a bit loose not as much as some people but its only when it is cheap i will take the flop (but when it comes to cash games strategy is different)

but you do see some players calling with 3-7 offsit and other crap.

good point but i am using low pot limit as learning experience so sometimes that chance is curious to take just to calculate odds after the flop

Mark

[sand_man808]

If you seriously get bored that easily, maybe poker isn't a game for you. I'm not trying to be mean or anything, but poker is a game of patience and people. Instead of watching TV or listening to music, YOU SHOULD BE WATCHING HOW YOUR OPPONENTS PLAY. That's just my 2 cents

[Fat Tony]

rookies too often forget the golden rule when it comes to low/middle pocket pairs..."no set= no bet"

[SnakeOiler]

I'd like to add.

No one tries to steal $3's worth of blinds, so if someone raises preflop they probably have a good hand to start with. Get out while you can if your sitting their with nothing but crap. You aren't going to be able to turn crap into gold often enough to make it worth it.

[BorisMcN]

I'd like to add.

No one tries to steal $3's worth of blinds,

I have to disagree - they do and will, not all the time ...and probably not always with a total garbage hand

If you're a beginner, you'll probably play tight (as you should), and some players will observe that you will fold the blinds to a raise. That means that they are prepared to bluff raise in an attempt to steal.

The only thing you can do when you're in the blinds, is properly defend them.

I borrowed this from about.com's casino guide

Defending the Big Blind.
Some players will always defend their big blind to a raise. Before you automatically throw more money into the pot there are a few questions you should ask yourself.

Who made the raise? It’s not too hard to figure out the types of players at your table. The maniac will be raising at every opportunity and the rock will barely bet unless he has a big hand and a passive player will usually just call many hands. Knowing the type of player who made the raise will be a big factor into determining if you defend or not.

How many players called the raise? If there are three or more players calling the raise before it is your turn to act, your will probably be getting good odds to call a single raise. You can call with any pair, connectors, or a suited ace. A good rule of thumb is to ask yourself if would normally play this hand for a singe bet if you were not in the big blind

What position was the raise made from? If the raise came from a player in early position it usually an indication of a strong hand. That is if the player is not one of the maniacs who has been raising at every opportunity. If the raise came from late position and no one has entered the pot to that point you are may be looking at a raise that was made in an attempt to steal the blinds.

Also if you havent read it yet, Internet Texas Hold'em is excellent, and has a great chart for playing both the SB and BB preflop...

This is all about preflop... playing after the flop is a whole books worth

BTW I dont mean to try and sound like an expert, cos I'm far from it... this is just my opinion from what I've read, heard and seen.

[hpman247]

just curious, but what constitutes as a calling hand. it seems as if you really dont know what you have until the flop, and you have to bet befor you see that.

[JohnnyCache]

Wrongo. The biggest mistake you can make is flopping too many hands.

The second biggest mistake is calling too many hands. If you start folding your garbage, you'll be able to afford raising your keepers. About the only time you should call is if you were going to raise a certain, defined about for some reason, but someone else did it in front of you and you still want to stay in the hand, or when you've gotten somebody to push money in the middle and you feel the hand is rich enough.

What I'm trying to say, is if your hand is worth flopping, it's worth begining to jocky for the win right away. You might think you're tossing extra bets away, but when you do take a hand all the way, your callers will have put more money in. You will find you push out more people chasing draws this way, so you will have a better idea of where you stand after the flop.

[boden12]

This is one of the reasons I love playing with my semi-manical friend to my right. Many many times he'll throw out a live bet (when he's UTG he will call the flop and raise the max) which lets me call awesome hands and then he nearly always (75% of the time or so) will raise it again as they give him last option even if noone else rasies (I'm not sure if this is 100% correct, but thats how they do it at one of the places we play). This gets the most amount of money in the pot for those times I get group 1+2 hands. People also loosen up when he does this and since most everyone is a poorer player they will not re-raise the live bet (which is supposed to be one of the best things to do as you could isolate yourself and the live better).

One of the best examples of how this worked out way in my favor was I was dealt pocket Kings. I think about a call, and then do, then a lot of callers follow suit. He re-raises like he always does, and I get to re-raise to milk the pot and squeeze out those poor hands. I get to play against 3 people, the pot is already great and few people start to respect the hand until I continue to bet and raise at the turn (as long as nothing scary is out there). Then I drag a pot 2-3x the size I would normally get with pocket Kings.

. About the only time you should call is if you were going to raise a certain, defined about for some reason, but someone else did it in front of you and you still want to stay in the hand, or when you've gotten somebody to push money in the middle and you feel the hand is rich enough.

[JohnnyCache]

I left out a circumstance: When you have a hand that is a very likely winner and you want the person to keep betting and or improve their hand on subsequent cards (slow-playing) I don't happen to think this is a good thing for beginners to do, so I didn't mention it, but the discussion here got pretty comprehensive, so ...

The other thing that makes coming in hard when you would tend to call pay off, is that is when you find people folding down to you in mid hand - particularly with a medium number of players (3-5 counting yourself).

[GailMI]

This is really interesting for me, because I'm what I would define as an "advanced" beginner. The HARDEST hands for me to fold are A-small card--especially suited. I have to grit my teeth (honestly) when I do it.
I have no problem letting go of smallish pockets when overcards come on the flop. But if all smaller rags come on the flop, I might bet into the pot. Is that a big mistake?

Also, I have trouble letting go of AK, even when I miss on the flop. I have to say, I usually hang around for the turn.

One more question/comment. I’m working hard on controlling it, but I think one thing that drives beginners crazy is watching these maniacs play every hand, get lucky as all get out and win and win and win. Then what often happens to me is that the ONE time I go in against the guy (with say second pair on the board) he has some some pocket high pair or something. Sends me into tilt real quick. I mean I just watched the guy bet to the river on NOTHING the past 10 hands in a row, and THIS time he has pocket queens….yuck. I have to do a lot of “talking to myself.â€Â

[JohnnyCache]

my advice? cheap tournaments. 5 or 10 dollar sitNgos are where a lot of people on this forum seem to agree there is a good conjunction of reasonable play, money to be made, and low (and fixed) risk... just stay cool until one or two people are out.

as for A paired with a gapped undercard, that's a disaster. That's one of the biggest things I've learned. As for easing laydowns, if it bothers you that much, just don't watch. There's plenty of chances to study the people when you aren't invovled in a hand, and if it's what you need to do, just let it go once you fold.

[GailMI]

Johnny: Thanks! Actually, that's what we've pretty much come down to online--$5 & $10 SNG tournaments, and we've pretty much held our own. Online my husband and I usually play together. Funny, because we take turns “reigning each other in when one tries to go on tilt.

We go to Vegas fairly frequently, though, and play the $2/$4 games. We’ve run into an occasional absolute maniac on these trips. Seems like everytime I actually went to head-to-head with one of these, though, I ended up losing. But maybe those are just the ones I REMEMBER…

Thanks for the advice.