Reverse timing tell

[MrDarling]

This is something I came up on recently and its the first time I used it.

As you all should know timing of opponent action is one of the biggest tells online, as well as the bet sizing.

In the following hand I was doubting on the flop if I should fold, call or raise.
Folding is defiantly a valid option, as one of my outs put 4 to the straight and it should prove hard to get paid, also, there is a chance I'm drawing to a split.

Raising is an option, but BVB it really hard to make someone fold TP, and its such a drawy flop I might be forced to put all my money here, which I don't really want.
So I decided if I hit an 8, I continue with normal value bets, but if I hit a K I'll go for a 'tricky' play and insta pot the turn + river.

If UB had a max button I would attempt an insta shove, but I think insta potting is such a fishy play and really look weak faking strong.

Villain tank both turn and river, but ended up calling.
Seeing is hand he probably call any turn bet, but I think it would have been really hard for him to call river with this "move"

Hand #51977402-20819 at Sunnyslope (No Limit Hold'em)
Started at 08/Apr/08 14:37:50

sebkrol18 is at seat 0 with $197.35.
DRedstone is at seat 1 with $211.65.
christofurio is at seat 2 with $95.
dabol is at seat 3 with $84.10.
meeelosh is at seat 4 with $147.50.
rko111 is at seat 5 with $343.60.
The button is at seat 5.

sebkrol18 posts the small blind of $1.
DRedstone posts the big blind of $2.

sebkrol18: -- --
DRedstone: Jc 9c
christofurio: -- --
dabol: -- --
meeelosh: -- --
rko111: -- --

Pre-flop:

christofurio folds. dabol folds. meeelosh folds.
rko111 folds. sebkrol18 raises to $6. DRedstone
calls.

Flop (board: Qs Ts Ad):

sebkrol18 bets $12. DRedstone calls.

Turn (board: Qs Ts Ad Kd):

sebkrol18 checks. DRedstone bets $36. sebkrol18
calls.

River (board: Qs Ts Ad Kd 5h):

sebkrol18 checks. DRedstone bets $108. sebkrol18
calls.



Showdown:

DRedstone shows Jc 9c.
DRedstone has Jc Qs Ts Ad Kd: straight, ace high.
sebkrol18 mucks cards.
(sebkrol18 has Ac Kc.)


Hand #51977402-20819 Summary:

$3 is raked from a pot of $324.
$.50 jackpot contribution is raked.
DRedstone wins $320.50 with straight, ace high.
----------------------------------------------------------------

[gumbie]

:sigh:

[xDiamond_CutteRx]

Timing means nothing IMO. There are a hundred reasons why someone might take a while to get his bet out: bad connection, too many tables open, chatting with the wife, etc.

I think you just caught a donk is all.

[Sean_in_NJ]

As you all should know timing of opponent action is one of the biggest tells online

Yeah, I'm with DC. I never paid any attention to this at all.

[miaowmiaowchowface]

They aren't always relevant, but a good application is to the guys who are talking, or sometimes the ones who say ZZZZ. They're prolly more "in the game" than anyone.

[Jauron]

If he's multi-tabling is he even going to notice?

[MrDarling]

No offense guys, but I do this for a living.

Timing and bet sizes are few of the only tells available online.
And though when someone takes some time to act doesn't always means he think about what to do, most of the time it does.
However when someone insta act, it is pretty obvious he knew what he was going to do before hand and didn't have to think about it.
What it means still depend on the type of player and any reads you have. My notes on player are full of timing tells.

[gumbie]

The only valid tells are the instacall and the "slight hesitation" differing from normal rythm, all other timing stuff happens by accident or on purpose.

[MJJ]

all other timing stuff happens by accident or on purpose.

No one can argue with that

[MrDarling]

all insta acts are valid (insta check/call/raise)
And in some rare occasions, delays also offer some information. Though often, not reliable enough to base entire decision upon. Its just one added clue to the mountain of information we need to digest when making a decision.

[gumbie]

all insta acts are valid (insta check/call/raise)
And in some rare occasions, delays also offer some information. Though often, not reliable enough to base entire decision upon. Its just one added clue to the mountain of information we need to digest when making a decision.

Delays offer information when ppl (like you) are doing them on purpose, so I advise against doing it.

[Muck]

I agree with bet size being a massive tell for on-line poker (and B&M for that matter) but I personally don’t assign much weight to timing tells.

Insta-actions are interesting but I rarely see people using them, apart from the fold one.

Sometime I see a player insta-limp but that’s usually when the guy in front takes his entire bar to decide to fold because he’s gone for a pee and the next guy decided he only needs to think if there’s a raise so just ticks the call bet option to keep things moving.

Other then that I don’t really understand them. I mean as you said it’s representing that “I know exactly what I want to do regardless of cards or other players actionsâ€

[Jauron]

I think some timing tells are helpful but the above was a reverse tell, and we have no way of knowing if villain is paying attention or even playing one table, not to mention aware of what they could mean.

If they are not looking for tells, it's a wasted effort usually.

[gumbie]

I think some timing tells are helpful but the above was a reverse tell, and we have no way of knowing if villain is paying attention or even playing one table, not to mention aware of what they could mean.

If they are not looking for tells, it's a wasted effort usually.

Aha! You found MrD's biggest leak.

ie assuming villains are thinking as much as he is or even thinking at all.

[Muck]

ie assuming villains are thinking as much as he is or even thinking at all.

Maybe he needs to practice on some mirco-limit tables It’s like trying to read a Chinese newspaper, through binoculars, that’s caught in a tornado...while also being blind