Sitting Out for 15-30 minutes

[Hawk_1MG]

I've found that I've been doing MUCH beter if I just flat sit out the first 15-30 minutes of a SnG on PokerStars. It seems to weed out all the morons that go all in just because they have an ace or king. Once the table is down to 5-6, I jump in, still have most of my chips and place 2nd or 3rd. I'm playing $10 - $50 games and this works most of the time. Enough so that I'm consistantly making money every session. Never fails though, as soon as I jump in early with a great staring hand, some goof calls my raises with squat and beats me on the river.

Opinions? Thanks.

[Absolution]

Hehe, you've noticed the one problem with that. It's hard to get first when some no fold'em has built up half the chips by calling all-ins. I find that they usually start trying to bully the table after. That's their weakness. They think that raising the pot every hand makes them a pro. It's frustrating losing to those guys when it happens though.

[Peerless]

Helmuth does it, works for him. I think I'll give it a shot.

[JohnnyCache]

I don't endorse just sitting out totally, you should still play things like high wired pairs and AKs . . . and you can see a flop when you're blind, if you don't get raised . . . but yeah, I like to let the idiots smack each other around.

[wEbMaStEr]

i totally agree with you Hawk_1MG i thought this was gonna be a rant against people sitting out so i was all ready to jump all over you

I play pokerstars $5/$10/$20 2 table sit & go's and i VERY rarely ever see the 1st 20 minutes, until blinds are up to 25/50

2 reasons for this.....

1: as you say, there are usually at least 4 or 5 idiots gone by this time. (no-one wants to be sucked in with a good hand only to see it smashed with crap by a no fold 'em)

2: even if you do get AA, AK etc in these first 20 minutes the rewards do not even cover the risks you face as the blinds are so small.

So i much prefer to wait until people have to think before they make a raise because the bet will effect them more, plus the rewards are greater.

p.s. even after these 20 minutes are up i dont just jump in, i still wait for high starting hands before i commit, and leave it till later in the game before i start playing/bluffing/drawing etc.

p.p.s. you not placing 1st isn't related to you not playing the fist few minutes, i've gone into final 4 with a couple 100 and still won, and i've gone in with more than half the chips and lost, its just 1 of those things, the wins will come

cya at the tables (unless we're both sitting out )

[wEbMaStEr]

Oh hey by the way!

talking of pokerstars.......

joined a $10 2-table game today, checked the player list to see who had what and guess who was playing at the other table .....

Only Tom McEvoy !

I actually got the chance to play with him for a few hands until he got knocked out (his KK against 2 pair all in)

What a thrill that was! to actually sit at a table with a guy who has not only played with some of the best players in the world but also a WSOP winner etc etc etc :D I was like a starstruck schoolgirl

And all for $10 !!!

(no, i didnt get to go up against him and no i didnt place in the tourney)

[JohnnyCache]

You can edit posts to add things. It's a little smoother on the eyes then posting twice in a row. . .

Sounds like you had a cool couple of hands there . . . for me, part of the romance of the game is that anyone can play anyone. . . it's a very democratic game.

[HalfSugar]

As much as I understand the logic, I can't stand people who sit out bcos it's a massive flaw with online poker. Maybe I am reading this post wrongly but I understand sitting out to literally have the sit out token on the table. If, in fact, u mean that u will fold everything for the first 20mins then fine, that is just super-tight early play but if u literally are not there or are basically spectating with the token in front of u then I think that's wrong.

[wEbMaStEr]

most times not even spectating geno, most times finishing another game, having a shower, doing housework, w/e.
I dont even want to see the hands i'm being dealt.
so yes just flat having the sit out token there, having the system folding every hand for you (AA's AK's BB's everything)
It's not just a flaw in online play only, as Peerless says Phil Helmuth doesn't get out of bed for the 1st hour in tourney play, so it aint just an online thing
I dont see how it can be wrong? if i am folding every single hand no matter what then it doesn't matter if i am there or not? and it shouldn't matter to anyone else sitting at the table cos it aint effecting them?
I don't know about other sites, but on pokerstars the sit and go's give you 1500 in chips and start the blinds at 10/20 going up levels every 10 minutes.... personally i think this is too low to start and would not mind if everyone at the table sat out until level 3, 25/50
just 1 guys personal opinion and it shouldn't effect anyone else at the table so it can't be "wrong"

[Sente]

The ony thing about Phil Helmuth being an hour late for tourneys is that he is playing in a multi-day tourney. The whole span is easily over 30 hours. Compare that to a one hour sit and go and that's like sitting out the first two minutes.

[Absolution]

Good call Sente. I just play very very tight at the start. Just as the blinds are small at the start, it's not a big deal to see a flop here and there if you have the chance to make a monster. Just throw it away if it's a scarey board. Most of the time they want to see flops so you can easily limp in these games early. Usually though, that just amounts to not playing for the first half of the SnG so it's really not that different. I also agree that it is fairly pointless to bluff or even semi-bluff in these until much later in the tournament. The same goes for multis. That's just common sense though. You have to tighten up your bluffs against calling stations/no fold'ems. Leave the mindless bluffing to the no fold'ems. Although, even late in multis I find they will still call out of curiosity. I'm very selective about my bluffs in these tournaments. I'm very weary to play any type of 'advanced' strategy in these usually. Most of the time it's completely lost on them (what's a check-raise?) and all you are doing is overthinking and getting yourself in trouble. It all depends on table structure though. That's another big thing. While you're playing the rock, it's good to watch what the others are playing with and make some notes. Then, when you jump in you can have a game plan.

p.s. Oh, and I'd still rather have half the available chips as opposed to a few hundred heading into short-handed play with big blinds.

p.p.s. You can take this too far. I find those people who just sit out or fold everything looking to sneak into 3rd, very annoying. Why are you even playing? I doubt they make any money in the long run anyway.

[Hawk_1MG]

I do click the sit out button, mainly because I find it too tempting to play AA or KK if I get it. And it never seems to fail that I get screwed early when I do. Yesterday I sat out 33 hands, jumped in when there was 6 of us left and proceeded to Monkey Stomp 3 guys out of the game. I hardly feel that I'm sneaking into 3rd place as I had less chips on the table when I finally decided to join.

Now I have seen guys play aggresively to say 5000 chips and then logoff. They know that they'll take at least 3rd. I don't agree with that, all's I'm dong is letting the table settle out, shake out the morons, and let's play some good poker. So when I bet 3-4x the BB because I have QQ or KK it's respected by the guys who have crap. I ended up in 2 on that SnG, but the guy beat my King high flush with the Ace, go figure.

[HalfSugar]

OK then, look at it this way:

If every1 used ur winning method, every1 would fold every hand to the BB every time until u all sat in which would mean every had their starting money but the blinds would be bigger.

It's only my opinion anyway, if it works then amen to that, money is money however unscrupulously u win it!

[Fat Tony]

if you want to play tight early to weed out some of the jackasses, fine. but anytime i see guys sitting out to try and place i make it my personal mission to try and take them out of the tournament. :D

[Absolution]

Well, if there were say 3 people left and one was sitting out trying to steal second, then I would probably ask my opponent to trade blinds until they eat this guy up. That way he'll at least get 3rd and the real players can take 1st, 2nd.

p.s. What up with the moderation lately? :/